Taurus revolvers and Liberty CD ammo: Incompatible?
I OWN A TAURUS Model 605 wheel gun. It’s made to fire .38 Special and .357 ammunition.
Firing 20 rounds of “range” ammunition is OK; but when that amount is exceeded, as it often is at a firing range, “bad things” happen.
Likewise, trying to fire more than five rounds of Liberty Civil Defense .357 ammunition requires an exercise in patience.
A FEW WORDS about the Liberty Civil Defense ammunition.
Get the lead out
From an “environmental” point of view, the ammunition is “friendly” in that is lead free. From a self-defense point of view, the ammunition is pretty good; it’s “a deep cavity projectile” (a/k/a “hollow point”) and fragments inside the target. From a shooter’s point of view, the .357 claims “reduced recoil.” Compared to American Eagle’s .357 that’s 100% accurate; shooters' hands quickly feel the difference.
According to Liberty’s web site1, all Civil Defense ammunition is “copper, monolithic, hollow point, fragmenting, (for) personal defense.”
My experience with the Liberty .357 product in the Taurus 605 has been “fire five rounds and wait.”
While I never intend to get into a gun fight, having to wait approximately 5 minutes between reloads even at a firing range — most of which charge by the hour — can be, at best, frustrating. It seems that the Liberty copper, monolithic etc. cases swell and cannot be removed (ejected/extracted) from the Taurus until the cases cool and return to their original diameter.
This did NOT happen with the Federal “range” ammunition; fire five rounds, tip up the revolver, the cases fall out. No need for the extractor rod.
A Taurus problem or a Liberty problem?
My experience with Liberty the company has been even worse than with Taurus..
I complained both to Liberty and Taurus. Taurus eventually responded — more on that soon — but even after web mail AND snail mail, Liberty still ignores the customer.
I posted the issue to a gun owners’ web site; the response from fellow shooter — NOT Liberty — was that perhaps Liberty was packing a bit more powder than the Taurus’ tolerances can handle. Another shooter on the Smith and Wesson user web site reported no complaints using the Liberty .357s, but that shooter was firing a Smith & Wesson revolver.
What I told Taurus
When I FINALLY got Taurus’ attention, I explained that I had two (2) problems with the 605.
Problem 1: The Liberty issue; cartridges go in but won’t come out.
Problem 2: The cylinder gets out of alignment when more than (about) 50 rounds of ammunition are fired. The barrel of the weapon also gets more than “warm” to the touch. (The temperature is not a concern by itself.)
Mind, with the 605, the shooter loads five rounds, fires five rounds, dumps the spent cartridges, and loads another five rounds. I don’t use a speed loader2 and I save my brass, so it’s not a quick process and there is some “cool down” time between “salvos.”
I explained to Taurus that I fired about 30 rounds of Federal .38 Special 158 grain LRN (target) ammunition and then fired American Eagle .357 158 grain jacked soft point ammunition. I managed to fire perhaps 20 rounds before the cylinder misalignment occurred. (I’d rather fire 100 rounds of Liberty’s .357 than 10 rounds of the American Eagle — the recoil is painful.)
What Taurus did
To its credit, Taurus paid shipping both ways. Then it kept the gun somewhat longer than the estimated six weeks — I didn’t complain; we had an unwanted guest named Irma that disrupted everything.
In the end, I got a call from Taurus telling me the gun was fine. When the gun was returned, I read that Taurus had fired 20 (only 20) rounds of .357 range ammunition and that nothing was amiss.
- Of course nothing was amiss. Taurus could not or would not replicate the conditions under which I reported the failures.
I offered to hand carry five rounds of Liberty Civil Defense .357 to their gate. “We can’t accept that.” Well, how about calling Liberty — the company is less than 200 miles north of the Taurus facility — and asking Liberty to send a box (of 20) cartridges … Liberty probably would have sent the goods gratis. Nope; not an approved vendor.
Basically, Taurus “tested” the 605 in ITS environment, not the shooter’s. If I know in advance that a product will fail if it is pushed past a certain point or will fail if an unusual product is used — yet not a prohibited product, and the Liberty is NOT “prohibited” on any Taurus literature I have seen — I will make certain to stop testing before reaching the failure point or will refuse to test in the customer’s environment.
Taurus is satisfied it met its “lifetime” warranty agreement, albeit it did nothing to resolve either problem.
Liberty remains silent.
And the customer fumes.
Since I cannot get a response from Liberty, I am forced to buy a competition’s product. How not to increase market share.
I would LIKE to fire a box of Liberty CD .38 Special ammunition, but I am loath to spend the money and wait a week, or three, for the ammunition to arrive and then face the very good chance that the .38 Special cases will stick in the 605’s chambers as did the .357s.
Cartridges vs. bullets vs. shells vs. cases 3
1. Liberty information: http://tinyurl.com/y93hb5oa
2. Speed loaders: http://tinyurl.com/ybqkxcvb
3. Ammunition definitions: http://tinyurl.com/y95xpdo3
PLAGIARISM is the act of appropriating the literary composition of another, or parts or passages of his writings, or the ideas or language of the same, and passing them off as the product of one’s own mind.
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